I can't take it anymore. Why do I have to be forced to take a plastic bag when I go to a store? Time after time, regardless of the store, I have these bags shoved down my throat. I try as hard as I can to yell out that I have a bag before they grab my items and toss it in the fresh plastic but often I am too slow and they are too fast. Very nicely I apologize and tell them I have a bag and I ask them to please use it for the next customer but most times I see them crumple it up and throw it out. I see this almost everywhere with the exception of most people who work at the Co-Op. I have been told that by law I must take a single beer out of the store in a plastic bag despite just putting it in the cloth bag that I have with me. Sometimes I have resorted to begging them to not give me a bag and even that doesn't work. I think if I ever snap it is going to be because of this issue.
How did this culture get started? It just makes no sense at all. It costs the company money to make these bags. I'm not saying that I don't think bags should be offered. I really am not an extremist, I actually am quite reasonable. Sometimes I like to have bags available because we all find ourselves needing them for unexpected purchases one time or another. I just don't get what is wrong with these cashiers that just toss a bag in the trash after I ask them to use it for another customer. Do they hate the earth and want to see it destroyed? is their bagging speed so greatly increased by throwing away the bag I rejected instead of taking the extra second it might take to use that same bag for someone else? I don't think that there really is any reasonable answer for why we do things the way we do.
Since logic and reason does not motivate us, then I believe the answer is to tax the bags. I'm not sure exactly how the logistics of it would work out but I'm thinking .10 to .25 a bag (paper included). The tax would put the burden on the customer not the business. The funds from the tax should be used for cleaning trash from our waterways. Maybe some of the money could be returned to the customer if they bring the bags back for recycling (again logistics)?
This tax I think is different from other taxes including the cigarette tax because the customer really has a choice and can very easily change their ways to avoid the tax. My proposed tax would also benefit us all without being a huge financial burden for our government or even the people who choose to pay the bag tax by opting not to use re-usable bags. If there was a bag tax everyone would win except the plastic bag workers. I know some people want to live in anarchy and don't want the government taxing things but I really think that this would be a good move on the federal level. I think, as evidenced by the oil spill in the gulf, that what we are doing is not working and we are all going to suffer for it. One person's right to throw away a plastic bag is infringing on another person's right to live in a clean and healthy environment.
Libertad's Journal
My Podcast Link
05/17/2010 21:28 #51672
I don't want the friggin bag05/15/2010 18:29 #51634
Illusions grand opening~4 REAL~
Mike and I think we will be going. Anyone else want to join us?
tinypliny - 05/17/10 21:51
Ah! I see. Thanks, (e:metalpeter). You are right, though. I had to look up the show name on wikipedia. :-)
Ah! I see. Thanks, (e:metalpeter). You are right, though. I had to look up the show name on wikipedia. :-)
libertad - 05/17/10 21:44
This is not really a big deal, at least in my mind. I just thought some on (e:strip) would be interested and I was right.
This is not really a big deal, at least in my mind. I just thought some on (e:strip) would be interested and I was right.
metalpeter - 05/17/10 17:19
Well Yes (e:Tinypliny) it is Huge if you ever saw the show you would know what I mean, HA.
As A "Stright" what ever that means male I will admit I don't get it completely, but I think it is a huge deal.
I'm not saying that they haven't had "Gay Dance Clubs" open before with some famous "Gay Celeb" in Buffalo, but If they had I have never heard of it. In the "Stirght" Dance clubs this is how they open them with some famous Person. Recently it seems that a lot of People from MTV shows like Jersy Shore and Real World shows have done the tours for years.
I admit I'm not the really the person who would know if it is a big deal, but I thought since no one has if it is or not since (e:tinypliny)'s question I would throw my 2 cents in.....
Well Yes (e:Tinypliny) it is Huge if you ever saw the show you would know what I mean, HA.
As A "Stright" what ever that means male I will admit I don't get it completely, but I think it is a huge deal.
I'm not saying that they haven't had "Gay Dance Clubs" open before with some famous "Gay Celeb" in Buffalo, but If they had I have never heard of it. In the "Stirght" Dance clubs this is how they open them with some famous Person. Recently it seems that a lot of People from MTV shows like Jersy Shore and Real World shows have done the tours for years.
I admit I'm not the really the person who would know if it is a big deal, but I thought since no one has if it is or not since (e:tinypliny)'s question I would throw my 2 cents in.....
james - 05/16/10 17:09
If they keep having a grand opening every weekend maybe people will start to come?
That said, I am in.
If they keep having a grand opening every weekend maybe people will start to come?
That said, I am in.
tinypliny - 05/15/10 21:43
Is this a big deal? Why?
Is this a big deal? Why?
paul - 05/15/10 19:37
I'm up for it.
I'm up for it.
04/24/2010 15:22 #51446
Try not to look so illegal
04/20/2010 21:36 #51432
420 BikeI got a new bike today! I didn't even realize this until after, but buying a bike today is significant because my last bike was a Technium 420 and today is April 20th! It made me feel like I made the right decision. My first ride was to the river where I got to see how the fisherman have already filled the pier with trash and it has only been three days since we cleaned it up. I like the new bike a lot and am excited to break it in. Right now ass is pretty sore because it hasn't been broken in yet.
Here it is, a Jamis Satellite...
Here it is, a Jamis Satellite...
tinypliny - 04/28/10 18:50
Very cool bike indeed! I really would like to go riding with you (well... once my bike stops making that weird noise!)
Very cool bike indeed! I really would like to go riding with you (well... once my bike stops making that weird noise!)
heidi - 04/21/10 22:29
Congrats on the bike! It looks very happy among the daffodils.
Congrats on the bike! It looks very happy among the daffodils.
metalpeter - 04/21/10 18:13
Glad 4/20 was good to you (HA), and Glad you got a bike you like.
Glad 4/20 was good to you (HA), and Glad you got a bike you like.
matthew - 04/21/10 17:07
nice! we should all go on a bike ride some evening.
nice! we should all go on a bike ride some evening.
jason - 04/21/10 10:10
I am also happy for you, Libertad. It might motivate me to get my bike back into shape and get some exercise.
I am also happy for you, Libertad. It might motivate me to get my bike back into shape and get some exercise.
04/24/2010 22:20 #51448
The Plastic CrisisI call this the Plastic Crisis. You might think this doesn't matter to you, but this is where we get our drinking water from. This is the beginning of the Niagara river. Our drinking water is pulled from the Niagara downstream from where these photos are taken, downstream from the sewage treatment facility, downstream from a waterway plagued by a history of industry. Plastic does break down. While it slowly degrades, it releases chemicals into the water. It breaks down into smaller and smaller pieces becoming greater and greater threats to our ecosystem. Every single piece of plastic counts and contributes to a huge environmental disaster. Again, as evident by the plastic tampon applicators, what you put down your drains will end up in our drinking water.
This isn't exactly plastic but oil which is what plastic is anyways. There is some type of fish, maybe salmon, which are spawning here. People will eat these fish.
I plan on alerting you all to the next river clean ups which really do a great deal to combat this crisis. They clean up the nation's waterways twice a year but the amount of trash being added outmatch the amount of volunteers needed to clean it all up. The worst thing about all of this is that most of this could be prevented. So much of this trash is from ignorance and complacency. We all need to wake up.
This isn't exactly plastic but oil which is what plastic is anyways. There is some type of fish, maybe salmon, which are spawning here. People will eat these fish.
I plan on alerting you all to the next river clean ups which really do a great deal to combat this crisis. They clean up the nation's waterways twice a year but the amount of trash being added outmatch the amount of volunteers needed to clean it all up. The worst thing about all of this is that most of this could be prevented. So much of this trash is from ignorance and complacency. We all need to wake up.
ladycroft - 04/29/10 06:56
we just had a 'day without plastic' campaign on our campus! we did a beach clean-up, gave away reusable grocery bags, and talked about these issues!!
we just had a 'day without plastic' campaign on our campus! we did a beach clean-up, gave away reusable grocery bags, and talked about these issues!!
libertad - 04/27/10 20:59
It is nice to see all the comments, it shows people do care. Reduce, reuse, recycle is so key (e:theecarey). It seems that so many of us forget the importance of implementing all three. This has got to become part of our being. We can't think that after we die we won't have to deal with it anymore or that it won't matter.
I have been deeply mourning what has happened to our water, our earth and our air. We are in serious trouble and it is time that drastic action be taken to lessen the effects of our causes.
(e:metalpeter), your thoughts are very insightful. Those energy bulbs you speak of are very dangerous. They are not the answer in themselves. When they break the toxic mercury is immediately released into the environment.
I will bring you a recycle bin if you want to start recycling metalpeter. If you put it out they will have to come and pick it up. If they don't I will call and let them know that they aren't. Everyone in this city can recycle. You can influence your neighbors by your actions.
It is nice to see all the comments, it shows people do care. Reduce, reuse, recycle is so key (e:theecarey). It seems that so many of us forget the importance of implementing all three. This has got to become part of our being. We can't think that after we die we won't have to deal with it anymore or that it won't matter.
I have been deeply mourning what has happened to our water, our earth and our air. We are in serious trouble and it is time that drastic action be taken to lessen the effects of our causes.
(e:metalpeter), your thoughts are very insightful. Those energy bulbs you speak of are very dangerous. They are not the answer in themselves. When they break the toxic mercury is immediately released into the environment.
I will bring you a recycle bin if you want to start recycling metalpeter. If you put it out they will have to come and pick it up. If they don't I will call and let them know that they aren't. Everyone in this city can recycle. You can influence your neighbors by your actions.
theecarey - 04/27/10 14:45
Sadly, these are some of the same images I remember being confused by as a kid in the 80s. I couldn't understand why there was so much debris, and more specifically, plastic tucked away among rocks and drift wood along the river edge. Oy.
So..Yes! Reduce-->Reuse--Recycle!! The amount of excess is overwhelming. As you have pointed out, although recycling is an option, the primary focus needs to be on reducing our need and use of products. Recycling is a strain in resources but at least much less so than tossing into a trash heap. I'm with you in trying to do so much more, and quite frankly, I think my life will be greatly redefined by these modifications-- how can it not! What I have done, is simply not enough! It can be hard when people think I'm nuts, but I really don't care. I've been learning a lot more about the life cycle of a product (and all of the resources it takes to create the product, or support the process of getting to the end result, through to the end of using the product and all that is involved in either tossing it out or recycling it, etc), and it is worrisome to say the least.
So I am always down for some collective discussion on these matters-for support, for knowledge, for inspiration and so on! :)
Sadly, these are some of the same images I remember being confused by as a kid in the 80s. I couldn't understand why there was so much debris, and more specifically, plastic tucked away among rocks and drift wood along the river edge. Oy.
So..Yes! Reduce-->Reuse--Recycle!! The amount of excess is overwhelming. As you have pointed out, although recycling is an option, the primary focus needs to be on reducing our need and use of products. Recycling is a strain in resources but at least much less so than tossing into a trash heap. I'm with you in trying to do so much more, and quite frankly, I think my life will be greatly redefined by these modifications-- how can it not! What I have done, is simply not enough! It can be hard when people think I'm nuts, but I really don't care. I've been learning a lot more about the life cycle of a product (and all of the resources it takes to create the product, or support the process of getting to the end result, through to the end of using the product and all that is involved in either tossing it out or recycling it, etc), and it is worrisome to say the least.
So I am always down for some collective discussion on these matters-for support, for knowledge, for inspiration and so on! :)
metalpeter - 04/26/10 17:52
I'm not saying I'm mister green at all, and there is an entire being green to be cool movement that makes me sick. Often what is being green isn't as simple as it looks. For example lets say an entire block or area of the city or even maybe a city changed to those funny looking light bulbs that in some lamps and lights stick past the shades. Well most people think that is a good thing and that they last so much longer. Well what happens when you have all this Mercury (since it is in the bulbs) and what do you do with it? I know put it in a land fill and taint the water. See that would be worse then just using the old lights. So it isn't really simple.
I admit I don't do as much as I should. Where I live we don't have bins. What I think would be great is those things up on elmwood or the things they have in Toronto (Yes it would be costly at first) On every block or maybe every other block or maybe just in front of apartment buildings what ever would fit the Buffalo Population and have them all over town and there would be special trucks that would go around and collect the recycle stuff.
(e:tinypliny) the thing about the fruits I have an idea about why they are that way, well more of a theory.
1. Fruit is sold by weight so this enclosed thing means the store doesn't need scales or anyone to way stuff in that department (big Cost Saver). Plus that way you don't have to have things weighed when you check out.
2. Sanitary things.
A. Closed no one touches them or spit or sweets or any thing like that
b. No Bugs landing on the fruit.
????? It used to be that some fruit came in a little basket with a handle. I wonder if those wooden basket (trees cut down in some form) are better or worse then the plastic cause how could you reuse those?
I'm not saying I'm mister green at all, and there is an entire being green to be cool movement that makes me sick. Often what is being green isn't as simple as it looks. For example lets say an entire block or area of the city or even maybe a city changed to those funny looking light bulbs that in some lamps and lights stick past the shades. Well most people think that is a good thing and that they last so much longer. Well what happens when you have all this Mercury (since it is in the bulbs) and what do you do with it? I know put it in a land fill and taint the water. See that would be worse then just using the old lights. So it isn't really simple.
I admit I don't do as much as I should. Where I live we don't have bins. What I think would be great is those things up on elmwood or the things they have in Toronto (Yes it would be costly at first) On every block or maybe every other block or maybe just in front of apartment buildings what ever would fit the Buffalo Population and have them all over town and there would be special trucks that would go around and collect the recycle stuff.
(e:tinypliny) the thing about the fruits I have an idea about why they are that way, well more of a theory.
1. Fruit is sold by weight so this enclosed thing means the store doesn't need scales or anyone to way stuff in that department (big Cost Saver). Plus that way you don't have to have things weighed when you check out.
2. Sanitary things.
A. Closed no one touches them or spit or sweets or any thing like that
b. No Bugs landing on the fruit.
????? It used to be that some fruit came in a little basket with a handle. I wonder if those wooden basket (trees cut down in some form) are better or worse then the plastic cause how could you reuse those?
jenks - 04/25/10 19:07
ugh. that is really horrifying and depressing.
(but mildly amusing: that at the top of this post, it said "like tires in a polluted river, these are the blogs of our lives" hahaha
ugh. that is really horrifying and depressing.
(but mildly amusing: that at the top of this post, it said "like tires in a polluted river, these are the blogs of our lives" hahaha
libertad - 04/25/10 17:31
Whoa (e:tinypliny), don't become so unhinged ;) I don't want to reuse the plastic I have. It gets bacteria in it and it is hard to clean. The cloth bags can be washed whenever and I will buy them new because I can't sew.
Whoa (e:tinypliny), don't become so unhinged ;) I don't want to reuse the plastic I have. It gets bacteria in it and it is hard to clean. The cloth bags can be washed whenever and I will buy them new because I can't sew.
tinypliny - 04/25/10 17:18
Better yet, you could reuse the plastic produce bags you already have or make cloth ones from old cotton clothes you might throw away.
Better yet, you could reuse the plastic produce bags you already have or make cloth ones from old cotton clothes you might throw away.
tinypliny - 04/25/10 17:16
Man, I feel like I could go on and on about my endless guilt at not doing enough...
Thanks for making this post!! I feel like I am getting more determined to make the more difficult changes in my life to cut down consumption even more. Just looking at all that trash is strengthening my resolve.
I promise not to drink out of plastic cups ANYWHERE anymore. I will take my water bottle everywhere. Also, I promise that I will 100% remember to take an empty lunch box with me when I go out to eat - so that I don't bring home containers to throw away. I also will have a plastic fork, knife and spoon in my bag all the time so that I am NEVER tempted to take any more new plastic flatware from ANYWHERE.
Man, I feel like I could go on and on about my endless guilt at not doing enough...
Thanks for making this post!! I feel like I am getting more determined to make the more difficult changes in my life to cut down consumption even more. Just looking at all that trash is strengthening my resolve.
I promise not to drink out of plastic cups ANYWHERE anymore. I will take my water bottle everywhere. Also, I promise that I will 100% remember to take an empty lunch box with me when I go out to eat - so that I don't bring home containers to throw away. I also will have a plastic fork, knife and spoon in my bag all the time so that I am NEVER tempted to take any more new plastic flatware from ANYWHERE.
libertad - 04/25/10 17:14
There really shouldn't be any need to sell things in this manner. It would be CHEAPER to sell them naked like they come. I'm going to buy some cotton produce bags which should significantly reduce my plastic misuse. I need to get this filthy plastic out of my life!
There really shouldn't be any need to sell things in this manner. It would be CHEAPER to sell them naked like they come. I'm going to buy some cotton produce bags which should significantly reduce my plastic misuse. I need to get this filthy plastic out of my life!
tinypliny - 04/25/10 17:06
Oh and shampoo, soap, conditioner - how awesome would it be were it all sold from dispensers instead of millions and millions of plastic bottles and packs and whatnots... Looking at my recycling pile gives me a heartache everytime. And all those bales and bales of "coupon newspapers". WHY do they have to send them to every household in bulk??!
Oh and shampoo, soap, conditioner - how awesome would it be were it all sold from dispensers instead of millions and millions of plastic bottles and packs and whatnots... Looking at my recycling pile gives me a heartache everytime. And all those bales and bales of "coupon newspapers". WHY do they have to send them to every household in bulk??!
tinypliny - 04/25/10 17:03
An example of small plastic things that are so annoying are those berry containers! WHY do they have to sell them in plastic? And of course, all those dried fruits - also in plastic. As if that weren't enough, they package veggies (especially chillies and beans) in plastic AND styrofoam trays. Aarrgh.
An example of small plastic things that are so annoying are those berry containers! WHY do they have to sell them in plastic? And of course, all those dried fruits - also in plastic. As if that weren't enough, they package veggies (especially chillies and beans) in plastic AND styrofoam trays. Aarrgh.
tinypliny - 04/25/10 17:01
I agree with you. I feel guilty ALL the time I am grocery shopping because I feel I am not doing enough to reduce waste. I get milk and that is in plastic or cartons. I have cut down plastics by a LOT but still end up with plastic bags for small things. I just hate all the excess packaging in everything. An alternative is to shop at the Coop for bulk stuff - but the Coop has really unreasonable prices. For someone trying to live within a budget, it's not very financially responsible to be shopping at the Coop.
I agree with you. I feel guilty ALL the time I am grocery shopping because I feel I am not doing enough to reduce waste. I get milk and that is in plastic or cartons. I have cut down plastics by a LOT but still end up with plastic bags for small things. I just hate all the excess packaging in everything. An alternative is to shop at the Coop for bulk stuff - but the Coop has really unreasonable prices. For someone trying to live within a budget, it's not very financially responsible to be shopping at the Coop.
libertad - 04/25/10 16:35
I would like to add that I feel that I am just as much to blame as most anyone else to contributing to this problem. While I feel like I have done a lot to change my own ways, I am guilty of not doing enough.
We really need to be aware of our everyday choices that contribute to this problem. Starting immediately I am pledging to reduce my consumption, particularly of plastics that can't be recycled. It seems that just about all of the changes I have already made are easy and sometimes much more logical than what I was used to. For example, the cloth shopping bags are so much easier to get groceries into the house than the plastic bags I used to use. I have also found that the changes I have made in my cleaning are not only greener but work better and more efficiently than the way I used to do it. I found using a cotton shower curtain in place of plastic reduces the amount of scrubbing I have to do because I can just throw it in the washer. It is cheaper than the plastic because it ironically lasts much longer at least in terms of it's usability. Recycling does take some effort but I have found that I enjoy doing it and making sure that it is done properly. Quitting smoking definitely reduced my footprint but also made me feel healthier and saved me a lot of money.
I don't think that glass is necessarily the answer (e:metalpeter). Honestly, I am not an authority on the environment. It seems that the basics will serve us well...reduce, reuse and recycle. At the present time, in this culture and lifestyle, it is a very difficult thing to accomplish on a widespread scale. The hardest part in terms of achieving it is certainly education.
The amount of damage we have done to the earth just by the use of plastics alone is already irreversible. Our best bet is that in some way the value of this litter will become so great that we will be compelled to start retrieving it. This may be possible through technological advancement and through supply and demand law.
I'm sure that we all can continue to be innovate in the ways in which we can begin to reverse what has been done. As great as plastic can be, I am afraid that it is much more a curse than a blessing.
I would like to add that I feel that I am just as much to blame as most anyone else to contributing to this problem. While I feel like I have done a lot to change my own ways, I am guilty of not doing enough.
We really need to be aware of our everyday choices that contribute to this problem. Starting immediately I am pledging to reduce my consumption, particularly of plastics that can't be recycled. It seems that just about all of the changes I have already made are easy and sometimes much more logical than what I was used to. For example, the cloth shopping bags are so much easier to get groceries into the house than the plastic bags I used to use. I have also found that the changes I have made in my cleaning are not only greener but work better and more efficiently than the way I used to do it. I found using a cotton shower curtain in place of plastic reduces the amount of scrubbing I have to do because I can just throw it in the washer. It is cheaper than the plastic because it ironically lasts much longer at least in terms of it's usability. Recycling does take some effort but I have found that I enjoy doing it and making sure that it is done properly. Quitting smoking definitely reduced my footprint but also made me feel healthier and saved me a lot of money.
I don't think that glass is necessarily the answer (e:metalpeter). Honestly, I am not an authority on the environment. It seems that the basics will serve us well...reduce, reuse and recycle. At the present time, in this culture and lifestyle, it is a very difficult thing to accomplish on a widespread scale. The hardest part in terms of achieving it is certainly education.
The amount of damage we have done to the earth just by the use of plastics alone is already irreversible. Our best bet is that in some way the value of this litter will become so great that we will be compelled to start retrieving it. This may be possible through technological advancement and through supply and demand law.
I'm sure that we all can continue to be innovate in the ways in which we can begin to reverse what has been done. As great as plastic can be, I am afraid that it is much more a curse than a blessing.
janelle - 04/25/10 15:38
I tend to have a live and let live attitude towards cigarettes and smokers, but after spending Saturday morning on Elmwood ave. with the clean up project, I was feeling pretty disgusted with cigarettes. There was very little litter other than cigarette butts.
I tend to have a live and let live attitude towards cigarettes and smokers, but after spending Saturday morning on Elmwood ave. with the clean up project, I was feeling pretty disgusted with cigarettes. There was very little litter other than cigarette butts.
metalpeter - 04/25/10 14:40
I know it shatters and is heavy but maybe all these pop and water people need to go back to glass? what do you think?
I know it shatters and is heavy but maybe all these pop and water people need to go back to glass? what do you think?
tinypliny - 04/25/10 10:31
The downstream effects of our "disposable" lifestyle. Nice way to "dispose" of all our inconvenient trash. :/
A majority seems to be from water/cola/milk containers and personal hygiene products. How can we change our lifestyle and pollute and consume less?!
Indians recycle a LOT at home. They don't buy what they don't consume. However, they come here and somehow a cultural switch turns off and they are rank among the most rapacious consumers and polluters. Most don't realize the value of recycling and conserving anymore. I was talking to a group of Indians recently about my 100 things challenge and I overheard some of them remarking about how I was odd and maybe borderline unhinged. *sigh*
The downstream effects of our "disposable" lifestyle. Nice way to "dispose" of all our inconvenient trash. :/
A majority seems to be from water/cola/milk containers and personal hygiene products. How can we change our lifestyle and pollute and consume less?!
Indians recycle a LOT at home. They don't buy what they don't consume. However, they come here and somehow a cultural switch turns off and they are rank among the most rapacious consumers and polluters. Most don't realize the value of recycling and conserving anymore. I was talking to a group of Indians recently about my 100 things challenge and I overheard some of them remarking about how I was odd and maybe borderline unhinged. *sigh*
paul - 04/24/10 23:35
That is so freakin gross.
That is so freakin gross.
i know, I know.
I am a horrible planet destroying monster.
Thank you so much (e:uncut) for the info. The absurd thing about giving a bag to someone who is buying a single beer is that it is probably the most likely to become litter. How many of these bags enter the waterways causing extensive damage?
I am absolutely certain that even the poorest of the poor would not be burdened by this bag tax. They simply will not take a bag. Poor people know how to live without spending a dime. A re-usable bag costs .99 and often is given away. If you want to help the most poor the best way is to give them an incentive to pick up plastic bags they find carelessly tossed into the wind. Paying them per bag or per pound of plastic they retrieve will motivate them to return to be recycled.
Banning plastic bags all together has some disadvantages. First, people would not be able to consume as much being bad for the economy. I will use a disposable bag when I do not anticipate that I will be shopping. If I had no way of carrying home any of my impulse buys I would not be able to make the purchase. Much of our economy is based on such impulse purchases. Second, we would have the inconvenience of not being able to bring home our impulse buys. Some of my best purchases are of these kind. Third, you would have an immediate lay off of the entire bag industry. They need to be found jobs elsewhere first.
The other reason this tax will help the poor is that they will find that many of the re-usable bags available to us make it much easier to carry what we are consuming. Poor people walk, bike and use public transport. There biggest benefit of the tax is surely being enticed to find out how much easier it is for you to carry your items in a re-usable bag. With a reusable bag you utilize your shoulders, where as the plastic and paper force you to use many more muscles to carry the same items.
Mike carries re-usable bags in his car. I almost always have a back pack and sometimes I keep a cloth bag inside of it.
(e:jenks), you would have helped the environment more if you didn't obtain your re-usable bags and then not use them. Most of those bags are often made of plastics and synthetics anyways. By not using them you are doing twice the damage.
I have about four reusable bags in my truck. I use them pretty consistently and only occasionally end up with a plastic bag, which I use to line the bathroom trash can. As soon as I'm done emptying them, I put them all on the door knob so I remember to take them out next time I leave. I love how much stuff you can stuff in one - instead of 8-10 plastic bags to deal with, I have four reusables. The handles are also much more comfortable to haul heavy loads up the stairs than plastic bag handles. (I posted pix of my community org's reusable bag project back in '08 :::link::: )
I can remember that at one time all you could get where Paper bags, and then many places moved into Plastic. Then place had both and the combo (paper inside the plastic bag). If what I remember is correct during the early days and maybe even now if you wanted the non perfered bag of the place you had to ask for it and often wouldn't get it. I'm not saying it is ok, but from what I understand Cashiers (not all of them) are trained to bag a certain way and to go for quickness. I'm guessing that other kind of bag throws them off. I also wonder if it as an automatic thing, you do something over and over again and someone hands you a differnt option and you just do it your way. I don't know if they still do this or not. But when I was a kid they had bagging contests. You bagged stuff and then they ripped the papper bag and everything was supposed to stay in place and nothing would be crushed. The Point I'm aiming at is if you went into a store where everyone used canvas and you where the one person who wanted Plastic cause you recylce it or use it as a poper scoper or what ever I think the same reaction would happen a lot.
In Terms of taxing bags, I think that is a bad idea. I think that it is up to the consumer to pick what kind of bag they want. Often times taxs just wind up being a tax on the poor. Let take the sterotypical poor family or single mother with multiple kids. Is she really going to go buy a bunch of nice bags (so her kids can destory them and mess them up at home) that she doesn't have the extra cash for. So that tax gets put on her and the people with more money buy the nice bags. My other problem with the tax is would it be on both plastic and paper, if you have heavy stuff would you then have to ask for double bags and get taxed more. Also what about places like price rite where you pay for the bags how much would those go up.
I'm not sure what the best way to do it is. I think plasstic and Paper bags should have incentives to recycle them. I have heard that you can do it at tops and Wegman's but not sure how many people know about it. Maybe all stores should do that. Or maybe they should just have a cart system where you push a button and it says put Items back into cart then you take it out to your car (if you drive) and put it in that way. Or maybe there is some law that says all check out isles have a button you push and it tells the cashier who in most places is the bagger now, those used to be 2 different jobs, what way you want it bagged.
In case anyone cares, there is no law in New York State that forces a store to put your beer, wine or booze in a bag according to Leslie W. Trebby, an associate attorney in the SLA’s Office of Counsel who said "I have reviewed the New York Alcoholic Beverage Control Law and the Rules of the New York State Liquor Authority and have found no provision that requires a grocery store licensed to sell beer (or a retail package liquor store) to place a purchased alcoholic beverage item into a bag
In the absence of a provision in the ABC Law or in the Authority’s rules specifically addressing this issue, I am of the view that the seller is under no legal obligation to place the purchased item into a bag." :::link:::
(e:jason) - to answer your question (e:leetee) and I keep reusable bags in our cars. I start out with 4 or 5 Wegmans bags and end up with zero. Since I rarely remember to put them back in the car until they are all gone.
I keep my bags (4) in my car, but often forget to take them inside. :(
I am one of the evil monsters that uses plastic bags. Sorry everyone.
(but I don't throw them away... they get stashed in the kitchen cabinet and reused as lunch bags, etc.)
And along the 'bag tax' lines- some places offer refunds for every bag of your own you bring in- but it's only 5c. So if I brought in 20 bags, I'd only save a dollar? I'm sorry, but that kind of money is not going to motivate anyone.
At first I thought "25c per bag?! that's a ton!" But then I realized that even on a 'big' grocery shop, say 8-10 bags, it's still only a couple bucks... Not unreasonable.
How many of you keep reusable bags in your car, etc? If so, how many bags?
It isn't so much that people are unwilling to spend 25 cents a bag, it is that a reusable bag would cost a dollar. That sort of math makes sense to people.
i hear ya. looking at the way they waste bags here would make your skin crawl. i only hope that by pushing education on the subject will slowly start to change things.
I would rather Wegman's have the money than the government, who inevitably squanders every penny. Although it's not as aggravating as a gas tax or a cigarette tax, it would still be regressive and the poorer among us would still be punished for not making the green choice.
I'm not sure if it's legit, or for that matter a federal bag tax, but the gov't could compel stores to charge for the bags. Maybe the government could take a piece. Honestly I don't think 0.25 per bag is really going to change the behavior of most people anyway, regardless of who gets the money. You would have to make it really punitive, like a buck a piece or more.
If someone put a gun to my head and told me to make a choice, I would prefer an all out ban on plastic bags to a tax. It's more honest, and it doesn't cause government to become dependent in some way on that tax. If the government is making free money on plastic bags will they want those bags to go away? I'm not so sure about that.
Good, constructive thought Libertad. In the end I would rather see the plastic bags go away as well but I don't have any good ideas.
Yes, (e:libertad), I got that meant you meant single beers which is why I specifically talked of six-packs.
I share your frustration on the amount of plastic we get when shopping. Even though, we recycle the bags, it would be better not to have them to recycle in the first place.
The reason that I mentioned complaining to the Wegmans management food chain is because I have learned talking to cashiers at Wegmans over the years that they are trained to put certain items into plastic before placing the item in another bag. If a cashier is still under probation, the cashier could get into trouble for not doing it. The newer the cashier the more likely he or she is to follow the rules.
I'll end by quoting Neil Young, "Take my advice, don't listen to me." <g>
sorry i didn't finish what I was saying. I am not looking for advice on how to avoid getting a bag. I do the things you both have recommended. The problem is much deeper than just my desire to reduce my bag usage. (e:uncut), what I was said about Wegmans cashiers is that they often will wrap my items in plastic before they put it in my cloth bag. I also said my trouble with beer was with a single beer and that was at another store not Wegmans.
Ok, I'm tonot looking for advice on how
(e:libertad) - I've had no problems buying a 6 pack and having it packed in my reusable "wegmans" bag at Wegmans and Rite-aid.
To avoid problems, I place my reusable bags at on top of my first item or at the beginning of my stuff depending on how much I am buying. Sometimes the cashiers have a hissy fit but my stuff always ends up in the bags I brought.
If you have problems with cashiers at Wegmans ask to speak to the front end manager. If that doesn't work ask to speak to the Manager on Duty. If that doesn't work, call Wegman's corporate. Keep your receipt. Try to remember or write down who you spoke with. They will eventually listen if you have documentation.
That is exactly my point (e:tinypliny). We shouldn't have to have strategies in order to avoid being given a bag. I can't believe I forgot to mention how great Guercio's is when it comes to plastic bag avoidance. The funny thing is that I always secretly want their plastic bags because they are the best around. They are smooth and don't make noise and are thicker than usual. I will try the P-BAR the next time I am out while I'm waiting for the bag tax. I do try to be really nice when I go to a cashier, next time I will kill them with my kindness and make eye contact asap.
(e:james) that is awesome that you are doing what you can. Good to know about the county. Maybe we can convince our "government should be run like a business" Executive, Chris Collins, that this would be good for business and the county? Thanks for the link to the article about the sucess of Ireland's bag tax.
Sometimes at Wegman's I give them my cloth bags right away but they still wrap my items in plastic before they put it in the bag. This includes non toxic cleaners, stuff as harmless as baking soda.
In germany we had to pay like 5 or 10 cents per plastic bag. It usually made us bring our cloth ones.
Aren't they illegal in San Francisco? (There's a legal precedent.)
Ireland has a small tax on plastic bags that has been dramatic in reducing consumption, by a whopping 90%! :::link:::
This is something I have been trying to implement in the city, but it seems we don't quite have the authority to do it without the county on board.
Hmm... I have managed to not get a single unrequested bag from grocery stores for the past two years. However, I will admit that I do make mistakes. Sometimes, I forget to take my own bag or buy more things than I can fit in the bag I have (always an ominous sign anyway).
I shop a lot in Pricerite and at Guercios. Pricerite doesn't give anyone any bags unless they request it and at Guercios, they listen to me, smile and then help load stuff in my bag! :-)
I think there is a trick to getting your request across in other stores (eg. walgreens, weggers etc.). You need to make eye contact with the checkout clerk way before your turn comes. That way, the clerk looks at your before automatically tossing the first thing into the waiting plastic bag.
I don't wait for them to start the "how's it going" checkout small talk. I start it while the customer before me is swiping their credit card or in the process of paying. It works every time without fail. You smile a great big smile and they have to look at you and smile back (I expect it will be really easy for you, since you are a natural headturner. ;^)) And then you say something pleasant - anything, so they can place your voice when you give them another huge smile and say "Please, no bags for me!" next.
Seriously, try it! I call it the P-BAR (Plastic-Bag-Avoidance-Routine).