First, I'm not sure you can call it a Mosque, or say that it is located "at" ground zero. But lets lay that aside for a second. Here are some things that conservatives traditionally value, that would seem to say, "let them do it."
1. Religious freedom.
2. The rights of property owners.
3. Decision making on the local level.
Many of the people who are fighting against this also fight for religious displays on public property, no matter how "insensitive" their opponents tell them it is.
I can imagine a US church attempting to buy and build a place for worship in Baghdad, and local lraquis protesting that they should not. What do you think the pundits would say about that? Likely, we would assert that anybody can build any church, anywhere, if they pay for it.
If the anti-mosque folks win this debate, they will likely come to regret it when Christians are in the minority (likely, soon) and the same arguments they've made are used against them.
You treat people the way you want to be treated, regardless of how they treat you.
Drew's Journal
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08/16/2010 11:26 #52457
Conservative values and the MosqueCategory: religion
06/12/2010 23:58 #51868
James is going awayCategory: estrip
And it is happening soon! (e:James) will be gone for Portland on Thursday. (e:Jim) and I ran into each other at a party and he helped me realize that the hour is upon us. We should gather with him and celebrate before he goes!
Wednesday night is the best evening for (e:janelle) and I, and it works for (e:James) and (e:Jim). How about the rest of you?
(e:Jim) was thinking Zetti's. I'm down. Also willing to play host at my house, but I have Pets, which means it would have to be outdoors for (e:Paul) and any other allergic folk. What do the rest of you say?
Wednesday night is the best evening for (e:janelle) and I, and it works for (e:James) and (e:Jim). How about the rest of you?
(e:Jim) was thinking Zetti's. I'm down. Also willing to play host at my house, but I have Pets, which means it would have to be outdoors for (e:Paul) and any other allergic folk. What do the rest of you say?
jim - 06/17/10 15:00
Sorry to everyone asking about other days, but James left this morning. Couldn't really reschedule. Thanks to everyone who was able to make it :)
Sorry to everyone asking about other days, but James left this morning. Couldn't really reschedule. Thanks to everyone who was able to make it :)
drew - 06/16/10 15:34
Can you guys be at Zetti's at 8pm? I may be a little late, but I will be there/then.
Can you guys be at Zetti's at 8pm? I may be a little late, but I will be there/then.
jim - 06/16/10 14:55
Is this happening tonight still? If so what time :)
Is this happening tonight still? If so what time :)
lauren - 06/15/10 11:39
You BOTH are leaving?? Aww boo...even though we didn't hang out all that much, it was nice to occasionally run into you here and there. Hopefully I will get to see you guys before you leave!
You BOTH are leaving?? Aww boo...even though we didn't hang out all that much, it was nice to occasionally run into you here and there. Hopefully I will get to see you guys before you leave!
heidi - 06/15/10 03:17
or losing.
or losing.
libertad - 06/14/10 23:41
I'm sad to see you guys leave. I wish I could participate in the dinner but with my mom being in town it would be pretty difficult unless it was on Friday or sometime over the weekend. If it is I will definitely try to be there.
I'm sad to see you guys leave. I wish I could participate in the dinner but with my mom being in town it would be pretty difficult unless it was on Friday or sometime over the weekend. If it is I will definitely try to be there.
jim - 06/14/10 21:00
Yeah, James and I are moving to Portland, Oregon. James is leaving at the end of this week and I'll be joining him in October.
Yeah, James and I are moving to Portland, Oregon. James is leaving at the end of this week and I'll be joining him in October.
lauren - 06/14/10 12:14
James is going away, as in, forever?
James is going away, as in, forever?
paul - 06/13/10 00:04
OOps, that was me. I was still testing stuff as news.
OOps, that was me. I was still testing stuff as news.
news - 06/13/10 00:03
Mike and dave and I all have Dave Mom in town at my mother's house dinner on wednesday night if any other night could work, that would be awesome.
Mike and dave and I all have Dave Mom in town at my mother's house dinner on wednesday night if any other night could work, that would be awesome.
06/06/2010 08:25 #51808
Pride paradeDo I lose my evangelical card if I take the kids to watch the Pride parade? As I remember it's pretty family-friendly (more church floats than anything else.) Are any (e:peeps) going to watch between Lexington and Lafayette?
enknot - 06/10/10 10:42
I think you get a free card upgrade. Without getting into a huge philosophical debate about the blah blah blah of yeah sure what ever, teaching tolerance for good people who want to live fruitful, productive (fabulous and fantastic) lives is always good in my book, and should be in every book but some books are different than others, but we must learn how to accept as many books as we can which brings it all back around....
Sometimes I think you should be made king of religion.
I like Drew.
I think you get a free card upgrade. Without getting into a huge philosophical debate about the blah blah blah of yeah sure what ever, teaching tolerance for good people who want to live fruitful, productive (fabulous and fantastic) lives is always good in my book, and should be in every book but some books are different than others, but we must learn how to accept as many books as we can which brings it all back around....
Sometimes I think you should be made king of religion.
I like Drew.
ladycroft - 06/08/10 09:45
this might be of interest to you: :::link:::
i'm working on creating an ally program and came across this resource.
this might be of interest to you: :::link:::
i'm working on creating an ally program and came across this resource.
jim - 06/07/10 09:36
In Portland every single church that I remember walking by had a rainbow sticker or flag.
In Portland every single church that I remember walking by had a rainbow sticker or flag.
james - 06/06/10 23:36
It is actually rather shocking how many church groups are represented at pride here. Not that it is shocking that there are LGBT positive church groups, but that they make such a large percentage of the groups represented compared to other city's pride festivals.
Also, wasn't there a romp-a-room for people to bring their kids to?
It is actually rather shocking how many church groups are represented at pride here. Not that it is shocking that there are LGBT positive church groups, but that they make such a large percentage of the groups represented compared to other city's pride festivals.
Also, wasn't there a romp-a-room for people to bring their kids to?
brit - 06/06/10 11:44
Good for you Drew, though, if I remember reading correctly Janelles' excellent journals about being a first time foster carer correctly would the authorities heads not explode sooner than the evangelicals?
Either way, I wish more dads were like you and Mike - it is the only way society can evolve and I hope if you do take them you have a wonderful day
Good for you Drew, though, if I remember reading correctly Janelles' excellent journals about being a first time foster carer correctly would the authorities heads not explode sooner than the evangelicals?
Either way, I wish more dads were like you and Mike - it is the only way society can evolve and I hope if you do take them you have a wonderful day
mrmike - 06/06/10 10:27
That's a pretty big swath. I might watch closer to Lexington. As a parent, you're in good company. I've been told by the fundamentalists that I'm going to hell and should have my son taken away for exposing him to the parade. Chose not to mention that the daughters were in it. Might have caused his pentacostel head to implode.
That's a pretty big swath. I might watch closer to Lexington. As a parent, you're in good company. I've been told by the fundamentalists that I'm going to hell and should have my son taken away for exposing him to the parade. Chose not to mention that the daughters were in it. Might have caused his pentacostel head to implode.
metalpeter - 06/06/10 09:32
I don't know where I'm watching it from yet really, it is kinda a feeling it out kinda thing. I think taking the kids would be a good idea. Besides it would sound kinda odd if you just went alone and left them at home. Will it shock them, not sure really, but I think it is important for kids to see that they should be proud of who they are, I know the parade is more then just about that. Yes having to much pride leads to bad things sometimes in life. But you should still be proud of who you are and not ashamed and hiding in a corner so to speak. Everyone has different beliefs. I think more people should not think homosexuality is a sin and that they are evil. But I also think that people who do think that way should at least think that even though they may dissaprove that everyone should still have the same rights. I say more people of faith should go to the Parade, but that is just my take.
I don't know where I'm watching it from yet really, it is kinda a feeling it out kinda thing. I think taking the kids would be a good idea. Besides it would sound kinda odd if you just went alone and left them at home. Will it shock them, not sure really, but I think it is important for kids to see that they should be proud of who they are, I know the parade is more then just about that. Yes having to much pride leads to bad things sometimes in life. But you should still be proud of who you are and not ashamed and hiding in a corner so to speak. Everyone has different beliefs. I think more people should not think homosexuality is a sin and that they are evil. But I also think that people who do think that way should at least think that even though they may dissaprove that everyone should still have the same rights. I say more people of faith should go to the Parade, but that is just my take.
05/30/2010 14:05 #51759
Summer in America.All of it, in one fluid (pun intended) motion.
This whole thing I find even more irriatating finding out they don't even have anywhere near the money to fund it. This in itself, I think, is immoral since it has really upset a lot of people unessasarily.
:::link:::
This has been an infuriating issue. The underpinning of the argument against the center is that all muslims are culpable for 9/11; just like all veterans are for Oklahoma City.
For so long under both the Bush and Obama administrations it was an official talking point that America wanted to work with moderate Muslims on improving our relationship with them. Then, when moderate American Muslims want to build their version of a JCC or YMCA suddenly we toss that out and elements of both the left and right are dead set against it.
We would do well to remember that the first foreign leader to officially recognize the existence of the United States was the Sultan of Morocco. Or, to borrow a line from the Treaty of Tripolli:
" As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion,—as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquility, of Mussulmen..."
It is one of the defining documents of American secularism. But, trash it and send 'em towel heads back to Mexico... or whatever.
Great Points. What I think people don't get or if they do get don't care about is that people who hicjacked those plans where muslum but that doesn't mean that everyone who is muslum argees with them. In Iraq a lot of the killing is one kind of muslum figting a different sect. Yes they do go crazy over that no pictures of the profit thing and there are extremists but there are extremist catholics who attack abortion clincs.
I can't believe this is even an issue, it just seems so ridiculous. I was really surprised the President spoke of it considering it certainly didn't do him any poll favors.