American healthcare isn't perfect. No country's is, but it is by far the very best in the world. Anybody ever stop to wonder why leaders and diplomats of the world come here to be treated and not in their own "Utopian" society? Why are we even considering allowing the Federal Government to take control over something the private sector does exceptionally well? Look at medicare, medicade, social security and the VA, as an example. Nearly bankrupt. Does anybody think that when everybody is on the government option that the quality will remain the same as the demand spikes and supply drops? The government needs to reform elements like malpractice lawsuits, immigration laws, etc that drive costs up for everybody else. We have a great health care system. Not perfect. The government has yet to prove that when it assumes responsibilites previously held by the private sector it improves it. Everybody please raise their hand who would like the gov't to have greater control over you.
Someone else responded
Jason, I'd be happy to tell you all about how I can't get any decent, affordable coverage because I had the audacity to survive Cancer.
Another responded about the $800 copay she paid for a wheelchair for her very very sick daughter.
I responded:
[BD] - how exactly do you define "best"? Most expensive? Yes. Most $ lost on corporate profits? Yes. Healthiest citizens? Nope. Most measurements indicate that the US has the worst or bottom of the barrel health outcomes of any developed nation and worse than some not-so-developed nations. For example, the US has maternal death rates of 11 per 100,000 live births in 2005, but Kuwait has 4, Croatia has 4...pages 30-34. Do you know anyone on Medicare who wants to give it up? Its administrative costs are minuscule compared to private insurance. The US spends nearly 16% of GDP on heallth care with poor outcomes while the other developed countries, who are only spending 7-10%, are getting coverage for everyone with good outcomes.
See also this Johns Hopkins report on causes of out-of-control US health care spending:
Jason - I'd be happy to give you an earful! :-)
Another responded:
Health is overrated! Why doesn't anyone stand up for being sick? We live in a country that respects your right to be ill!.
BD replied back to me:
Heidi, our people may not be the healthiest people in the world and insurance companies can be a pain to deal with for our country's system is not perfect, no country's is, but the QUALITY of care provided is second to none. Our system needs some reform but the more the government controls the more liberty we lose. I want private sector solutions that the government can't provide. We should consider the health savings accounts that incentives good health and responsible behavior not more government options that disincentivize poor behavior.
Tioga County, Child Care Worker, future high schoo history teacher.
and
also.....equal access will not mean equal quality or equal supply. it's be great if it did, but it can't and it won't. quality is more important that quantitiy.
The cancer survivor wrote:
I have to say that any option, government or not, has to control costs, and stop eliminating pre-existing conditions...I don't think the private sector will ever voluntarily eliminate pre-existing conditions.
me again:
[BD], again, I'd like you to define "quality." Outcomes are a great measure of quality. We are not getting the quality of care that we deserve, or that we pay for. Are the people providing health care top notch? Absolutely - they're the best trained in the world, however, in a fee-for-service system where defensive medicine is a requirement, their education and skills are not used to the fullest advantage. Our system is not focused on prevention or good long-term management of illnesses. See
and
If we really want to "disincentivize poor behavior" then we need to change the ag policies that favor Coke over broccoli - it's only personal choice to the extent that our food market is sick. (See the documentary Food, Inc.)
And BD replied:
Heidi, I will concede. Our system sucks and we should outlaw coke, pepsi, oreos, and cigarettes. We should destroy our system and model it after Cuba and tax insurance companies out of existance. Then all of us could be equal. Equally miserable. Last message.
I just want to take a moment to appreciate the depth of the conversations we have here.
(e:James) you make a great point there!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Here is the problem with the entire Health Care debate, and I think I may have said this here and on Facebook.
-Barrack Says what he wants the bill to include
-He doesn't write the bill
-He has no control over what the bill says
-Yet he gets all the blame for a bill that hasn't been presented to him yet
-Both sides seem to know what the Bill that he will sign off on is going to be and do
-Barrack has all ready changed his mind on what ever the public option is
If Barrack is telling the truth what he wants A government option that people can sign up for or if they have no Health Insurance then you pay into as a penalty or as a way to get you to sing up for.
The people who don't like his Idea think the Government is going to take over all Health Care. And when a Doctor wants to do something they have to see if the government approves it 1st. As Silly as this sounds to people on the other side, remember nothing has passed yet and you have people in local little towns getting into fist fights over a Federal Matter.
It all fucking drives me insane. Well not really insane.
On A side note America like how it does everything is fighting this problem backwards. If you want to improve Health and Health insurance you promote eating Healthy and you Make things that are Healthy say so and things that are bad say so and you promote eating Healthy. Yes it costs more to eat healthy but it starts in schools and how you promote it and get people to try and be fitter I have no idea but if you fix that, health care costs drop because no one is sick. Of course the other option is to clean up the air and water so people don't get all these infections.
Our nomenclature is fucked.
There is health care
There is health insurance
Our health care kicks ass
Our health insurance sucks ass
Yet in this debate, health care = health insurance. It is enough to drive a man insane.
Okay, I suppose I'm just used to being the only person pushing back. =) Interesting coincidence. I'm like who is BD? Haha.
Yeah, it's not you, (e:jason), it's my reporter friend Jason. The originals were on facebook, i just copied them here to illustrate nonproductive, uninformed debate. I copied most but not all of the conversation.
Okay, I think I'm mistaken, I just don't have all the pieces of the conversation. I always love the absolute arguments, like "Okay, you just want us to become Cuba" or "You just want old people to die." How can you debate that?
Did someone respond to me somewhere? And propose to give me an "earful" of something? I don't think I saw any of these responses, nor do I know even where the original post was.